Marlo Thomas & Phil Donahue on Making Marriage Work (In and Out of Quarantine)

Marlo Thomas and Phil Donahue celebrated their 40th anniversary this past May, an event they would have likely been celebrating enroute across America promoting their new book, the apropos "What Makes a Marriage Last." Instead the couple has been sheltering in place in their Manhattan apartment and been traveling digitally with their Marriage Caravan with media appearances.

For their book, the couple features in-depth conversations with 40 other celebrity couples about how they've stayed together. These include James Carville and Mary Matalin, Rev. Jesse and Jacqueline Jackson, Jimmy and Rosalynn Carter, Chesley "Sully" and Lorrie Sullenberger, Elton John and David Furnish, Jamie Lee Curtis and Christopher Guest, Michael J. Fox and Tracy Pollan, Neil Patrick Harris and David Burtka, Kelly Ripa and Mark Consuelos, Melissa McCarthy and Ben Falcone, Al Roker and Deborah Roberts, Chip and Joanna Gaines, and Kevin Bacon and Kyra Sedgwick, and more.

Publisher's Weekly called the book, "Delightful and instructive... Love and understanding shine through in this inspiring collection."

"Warmhearted testimony to enduring relationships...The authors' disarming ebullience makes them endearing interviewer," adds Kirkus Reviews.

EDGE spoke to the couple recently about their marriage, their book and the secrets to its success.

Feels like 20 years

EDGE: Happy 40th Anniversary. When you heard that, what immediately come to mind?

Marlo Thomas: It's unbelievable! It certainly doesn't seem like 40 years. It feels like 20 years. 40 years sounds like a lifetime and it doesn't feel like we have lived a lifetime yet.

Phil Donahue: I think about how much I have changed, and I think this chapter of our marriage is responsible for that. I think everyone should have a timeout like this virus has forced on us. I have observed my wife more during this lockdown than I have in the first 39 years of our marriage.

EDGE: What are you learning about each other during lockdown?

Phil Donahue: I have seen how multi-dimensional Marlo is. She is like a water bug. A water bug can make a 90-degree turn without any energy. She can do two phone calls at once along with the laptop. I've wondered how come it has taken me so long to see this. She is always busy. I have a greater respect for how talented she is and for how much she can get done at one time.

Marlo Thomas: Phil was always saying, "Will you just sit down for a minute or where are you going now." Now that we are locked down together, he sees more of what I am doing and now it doesn't seem like I am just mad dashing around. I really do have a plan to it all. What I noticed about Phil is how laid back he really is. Our personalities are very different, but I have also realized how much it complements my personality.

First impressions

EDGE: You two rarely speak publicly about your marriage. Why?

Marlo Thomas: Its funny, Phil said to me before we started doing these interviews that he was not going to talk about our marriage. After 40 years of being together, I certainly wasn't going to argue about that. I really wasn't sure how this was all going to turn out. Our marriage is sacred and we have always been respectful of it and to each other.

EDGE: When did you both realize that the other was The One?

Marlo Thomas: Well, Phil always likes to answer this question.

Phil Donahue: There is something to Malcolm Gladwell's book "Blink" – first impressions are very memorable. It certainly was with me and Marlo. When she first appeared on my show, and turned around and I saw the eyes and that smile and I thought, "wow!" That's when I knew. Not only was this going to be a great show, not only is she beautiful, but she is a movie star and she is politically alert and ready to discuss issues that would be important to my audience. In a lot of ways, Marlo was my perfect guest. As my mother would say, I was smitten.

Marlo Thomas: And then we flirted terribly with each other for the entire show. After the show, he asked me out to dinner and here we are 40 years later.

Have to connect

EDGE: Marlo, in the introduction to the book, you write about the small, day-to-day ways you two connect. Why are those things important for you and couples?

Marlo Thomas: There are moments that happen to you and your spouse that are personal to you. Things that no one else would know about. Your memories with each other bring value and it is something that you share with each other. There is a little coven of memories that you tuck away that you have. They are little links and chains that keep you together. It is made up of your values and your appreciation of things that you don't have with anyone else.

Phil Donahue: If you didn't connect or if you are not connecting, then that is the cloud of an approaching storm. You have to connect.

EDGE: What was the process for choosing the couples you interviewed for the book?

Marlo Thomas: We wanted to have people from a lot of different professions who have been married for a reasonable amount of time. We originally wanted couples who were married over 25 years. We interviewed President Carter (74 years), Alan Ada (64 years), and Billy Crystal (50 years). As we were interviewing couples with higher married years, we thought we should also get some couples who have not been married as long. We thought maybe there is a difference between couples who have been married a shorter period. We also wanted to include same sex couples, multi-race and multi-religion couples. We wanted to see how marriages change in all these different colors.

EDGE: Did you notice any trends when interviewing couples of different generations?

Phil Donahue: What we found out is, that it is not any different; it is all the same. Among the couples that have been married for a significant amount of time, that they were taking this union seriously. It was evident that they wanted this marriage and they wanted it to last.

Marlo Thomas: Everybody wants the same thing. They want to feel safe. They want someone that they can count on, someone who has their back. Someone they can love, and feel loved in return. Respect and trust are both very important to all the couples.

EDGE: Whose marriage advice surprised you the most?

Marlo Thomas: That is hard to say because everyone had something to tell us. For example, Kyra Sedgwick said, "That you can't go into marriage with a plan B." I think it is pretty much what we saw in all these couples: They got married for life and were not looking for an escape route.

Phil Donahue: As we look back on the interviews, all marriages face difficulties and no one can escape it. They can either face it together and make themselves stronger than they would be if they had to face it alone. There is no such thing as a smooth sailing marriage from beginning to end.

EDGE: Your anniversary was on May 21st. How did you celebrate?

Marlo Thomas: Usually we go away on a trip, but being self-quarantined, we didn't go anywhere. Time is the most valuable thing you have, so we always made it important to set aside life and go somewhere to celebrate each other. So, this year, we made dinner together with all of our favorite things to eat.

Phil Donahue: I did the laundry. I'm still having trouble with colors. I now have pink underwear.

For more on "What Makes a Marriage Last," click here.