Straight Drama, Smart Comedy, Gay Movie: Jamie Effros on 'Give or Take'

In the gay-themed comedy "Give or Take," New York-based actor and writer Jamie Effros plays Martin, the straight son of a recently deceased man who came out late in life and ended up with a younger boyfriend. Now that his dad, Kenneth, is gone, Martin ventures back to Cape Cod and a childhood house that's still full of memories – but also still full of Ted (Broadway star Norbert Leo Butz), the boyfriend, who has no intention of moving out and has nowhere to go even if he wanted to.

The situation quickly gets thorny, since Martin was semi-estranged from his father and Kenneth died without leaving a will. Modern audiences may simply assume that with the advent of marriage equality and the protections that it brings, same-sex couples would tie the knot and avoid such complications, but life is not always so clean-cut; it certainly isn't so simple in the film, particularly since Martin is also reconnecting with an old flame, Emma (Joanne Tucker), getting sucked into the schemes of a predatory realtor (Cheri Oteri), making friends with the philosophically-inclined stoner who tends his dad's pool (Louis Cancelmi), and worrying about strange noises in the attic. Meantime, his life back in the big city won't leave him in peace long enough to deal with things: Martin's not-quite-supportive girlfriend (Annapurna Sriram) and his high-pressure job only distract him from taking care of the business at hand.

It takes more than a house to make a home, and more than blood relations to make a family; will Martin manage to salvage either from the situation?

"Give or Take" is the first feature film for Effros and his co-writer, director Paul Riccio. But it's also a belated coming of age tale and a story of family reckoning that takes the usual tropes and turns them on their heads, finding new angles and perspectives. What's more, the film breezes past the usual gags and setups to find more relevant sources of humor.

After racking up an armload of awards on last year's LGTBQ+ film festival circuit – the Audience Award for Best Feature at Woods Hole, Best Ensemble and Best Screenplay at Out on Film in Atlanta, Best Supporting Actor for Butz at Film Out San Diego, among other accolades – the movie is slated for a limited theatrical run followed by a release to DVD and digital courtesy of Breaking Glass Pictures.

Jamie Effros took a few minutes to join EDGE for a Zoom call to talk about the movie, drawing on his life, and working with two-time Tony Award winner Norbert Leo Butz.

EDGE: When it came to deciding what was going to be your first feature film, why did you go with this story in particular?

Jamie Effros: Actually, it formed organically over time. It didn't come from a particular experience that either one of us had. It really came with formulating these characters. The things that I wanted to talk about were the things that I was going through in my mid-thirties. We were trying to hone in on what was me, versus what was expected of me by the world, and what I was doing to fit into particular boxes of career and dating and family life.

I wanted to show this character, especially in an age where we're constantly comparing ourselves to everybody, struggling with being true to who he is. The perfect foil for that was a character who was absolutely sure of who he was despite the odds that society had stacked against him.

Also, [we wanted to write to] themes of grief. Paul came to me with the idea that he saw my character as someone whose parent has recently died, and he has to sort through the life that he left behind in this house that he grew up in, but it's not his home anymore. Those are things that Paul has had to have to deal with in his life, and he imagined this character in this space. He had this visual sort of concept, and he came to me and he said, "I want to write this. I want to write a feature with you around this idea, and let's just see where it goes." And, six years later, here we are.

EDGE: There are plenty of gay movies about AIDS or coming out, but I'm not sure I've ever seen one addressing the problem of someone dying without a will, even though in real life it's not an uncommon problem.

Jamie Effros: I think that was something that Paul had had to deal with in his life – people in the family dying, and the relatives being left with figuring out what to do. I think in this story, again, it was one of those things that evolved pretty organically, and once it was there it was like, this is a really central conflict. The more we looked into it, the more we were like, "Oh, this really is a big problem." This is especially a big problem in the gay community, where marriage is still so new, and the legal hurdles are even larger because of the societal issues behind it. The familial stuff becomes even harder because of that.

We figured, "We've never seen this story before." I don't think we really appreciated how much that part of the story would resonate with people, that we would have had people say, "Thank you for telling this particular story." It's one of those wonderful, happy semi-accidents...but it's hopefully doing some modicum of good.

EDGE: As you say, marriage equality is still very new, and I think there's a perspective that people might have that, "Oh, now gay people can get married. These problems don't exist anymore." But that's simply not true.

Jamie Effros: Of course not. Yeah, I mean, the idea that suddenly something changes legally, and then it's, "Oh, it's all fixed." Our country has a bad history of thinking that way, and we can see the way that everything is playing out in, you know, school board meetings across the country at the moment.

It's the legal reality, but it's not the social reality, and it takes a lot of time for people to catch up on all sides to something that is still so new and accept it.

EDGE: It's very exciting that you brought Broadway star and two-time Tony winner Norbert Leo Butz into the cast to play Ted, the younger boyfriend of your character's late father. It's a delight to see him, and you two have great on-screen chemistry. How did he become involved with the film?

Jamie Effros: To be honest, very early in the writing process, as we were dreaming Ted up, we started talking about Norbert. I started seeing him as this character and I was like, "You know what, he would really be fantastic." I'd seen him on stage before. And I knew he was a New York guy; I have a particular love in my heart for New York actors just in general. So, we started writing with him in mind. We didn't really think that we could necessarily get him, but it was at least a touch point – we could carve a character around the idea of how the performance would go in our minds. Even if it hadn't worked out and Ted had been played by someone else, at least we'd have a really solid vision for who this guy is.

And then, honestly...and this is a story that probably Norbert hates being told...but I put a post out on Facebook to my theatre community, and I said, "Hey, does anyone know Norbert? I have a script that I really would love to try and get to him." And a friend of mine just happened to be good friends with his assistant, and we got the script to him. That never happens. But then the fact that he actually read it – that really never happens! When he read it and he loved it, he got back to us very quickly and said, "I think this is great. I laughed out loud, like five times during this thing. I would love to do this – let's try and put it together."

We were just bowled over. We couldn't believe it. That resulted in a roller coaster of, you know, we thought we were going to shoot it at one point, but then he gets a Tony nomination for "My Fair Lady," and "My Fair Lady" extends, and he has to go do that instead. So, we had to regroup. We had to figure out whether we were going to try and recast. We actually did a lot of looking around to perhaps recast, and it just wasn't a good fit. Finally, we just circled back around. When his schedule freed up, and he still was keen to do it, we were like, "Heck yeah, let's do it!" So he was in our brains from very, very early days.

EDGE: That's a terrific story.

Jamie Effros: Yeah, I really think it's a testament to not being afraid to get out there and try and find the person who's at the top of your list. Don't think that people are totally inaccessible. I think that we have this [mental] block, a lot of us who've been in the arts for a long time, that there's us and them, and never the twain shall meet.

As an actor, I think it's kind of a no-brainer that, when someone comes to you and [says], "I've been writing a script with you in mind," it's like, "Oh, my goodness. Well, I certainly have to take a look at this."

But [also], I think that people are hungry for good, honest material. I think that it's character-driven, honest, small stories that actors tend to respond to. And you never know what you can get when you actually get it in front of a person who you respect.

EDGE: Audiences also respond to well-written characters and stories. Having a theatre background and being a playwright, did you bring some of your playwriting tools and experience into co-writing the script?

Jamie Effros: Well, I think it's generous to call me a playwright. I have written a couple of plays which I tend to think more of as exercises than anything else. But I think the short answer is yes; being in theater, I think that you do get a sense of what makes a good scene. And I think that for character-driven work, that starts in the theater. I mean, that's where my character writing definitely comes from – the theatrical background, and knowing the shapes of those narratives and being interested in tracing every character's arc across the span of the story – and being more interested in that than, necessarily, the Plot with a big P. But also, making sure that you're telling a story. I'm not a fan of plotless films, that's for sure – though, plotless theater, they can get away with that a little bit better.

But yes, I think that my theater background absolutely was an asset, especially working with someone like Norbert. We could speak the same language as far as the acting was concerned. There was an ease there, even in the moments that I was peeing my pants because here I am on set with a Broadway legend.

EDGE: The movie is set and was filmed on Cape Cod, and there's even a key scene at the Wellfleet drive-in theater, but the movie never ventures into Provincetown. Why not? It's such a capital of gay culture and gay life. Was it just too hard to deal with the crowds, or was it permitting stuff that kept you away?

Jamie Effros: A couple of reasons. One, was it farther than you think it is. It's a bit of a commute to get up there. It's dense [with crowds], and it is difficult to get permits and things like that.

Paul had been going to Orleans, which is the town that we shot in and at his sister's house, for a very long time. He knew that area, and knew that sort of year-round blue collar part of the Cape, but I just don't think that he knew Provincetown very much. And I think that between that, and our prohibitive budget, [we weren't going to get anything filmed in Provincetown].

Actually, I think we did play around with a couple of scene ideas for going up to Provincetown and shooting something during the parade, or something like that, which would have been so much fun – but also, this was a small movie, and to have to be able to do that...like you said, the permitting and the logistics would have been a real big bite, so we didn't end up filming there.

And honestly, I had never been to Provincetown until we went to the Provincetown Film Festival – and I thought, "Oh, my God, this place is amazing! What a beautiful town."

"Give or Take" premieres in limited theatrical release Feb. 11, followed by a release to DVD and digital on Feb. 22.